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Re: (erielack) Re: LV-D&H Trains

Chuck Yungkurth wrote:
> All the info on when the LV / D&H got trackage rights to Owego is in 
> the article JJ Young and I wrote for the very first issue of RAILFAN.
>  Also, I recently gave Rusty Recordon a D&H track map of Binghamton
> on which the exact date the Erie gave the D&H track rights to owego
> in excange for the Erie to switch the Moon Feed Co in Binghamton. I 
> don't recall exactly but it was some time in the 1920s.

AIR, the D&H got its trackage rights from Binghamton to Owego on the Erie in
1903. When I Googled the other day  I got a couple of hits for newspaper
articles from the New York Times,  I cannot find them this AM and I
can't remember the exact search terms I used.
> 
> The LV never got any trackage rights on the Erie. Techncially they 
> were operating as D&H trains.
> 
> Chuck Yungkurth Boulder CO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon
>  Davids" <g.davids_@_verizon.net> To: <erielack@lists.elhts.org> Sent: 
> Friday, January 04, 2008 11:03 AM Subject: (erielack) Re: LV-D&H 
> Trains
> 
> 
>> Subject: Re: LV-D&H Trains; was: RE: (erielack)
>> 
>> Chuck Yungkurth wrote:
>> 
>>> Originally the D&H runs terminated at Owego where cars were
>> interchanged
>>> with the LV. Some time in the 1930's an arrangement was worked 
>>> out with the unions to allow D&H crews to run all the way to 
>>> Sayre and the LV crews to continue on to Binghamton, thus 
>>> eliminating Owego as the interchange point. For years the LV made
>>>  a day time run from Sayre to Binghamton and back while the D&H 
>>> made a trip to Sayre and return at
>> night.
>> 
>> Somewhat OT but completes this discussion.
>> 
>> The D&H obtained trackage rights over the LV at some time.  Perhaps
>>  the inducement for the TRs was the LV gaining rights to
>> Binghamton.
>> 
>> 
>> I went in anthracite rr and Googled  to find when the D&H got 
>> rights . I have struck out.
>> 
>> If anyone there is on a D&H list would they ask there?
>> 
>> bob gillis <<<< Bob -
>> 
>> Pat McKnight probably has the answer to the date in LV records up 
>> to 1927 on that subject.  It is not mentioned in the 1923 D&H 
>> History.
>> 
>> We should note that the D&H operated on LV, and LV operated on D&H-
>>  Erie, with operating rights, not trackage rights.  The Erie 
>> extended trackage rights to the D&H between Binghamton and Owego, 
>> and the D&H - LV interchange was always at Owego.  LV used 
>> operating rights granted by the D&H to operate over the D&H 
>> trackage rights between Owego and Binghamton, and the D&H used 
>> operating rights granted by the LV to operate between Owego and 
>> Sayre.
>> 
>> It sounds confusing, but that is how the tariffs, rate divisions, 
>> trackage rights payments and per diem were calculated.  The joint 
>> D&H - LV operation between Binghamton and Sayre was simply an 
>> agreement between the two railroads.  The labor organizations would
>>  not usually block an agreement like that as long as there was some
>>  good money in it for everyone.
>> 
>> Also, regarding my earlier note on locomotive assignments, the LV 
>> had an intermittent inductive automatic train stop (ATS) system, so
>>  most of their locomotives into the 1960's would have been
>> available to operate on the Erie.  The systems were compatible.
>> The D&H also had ATS  between Albany and Rouses Point until some
>> time in the 1930's, so they could have pulled equipped steam
>> locomotives from the Saratoga Division to use on the Sayre jobs.
>> 
>> Gordon Davids
>> 
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